I know JWs who sound a lot like Mary's sister. I was probably similar for a while, too. A lot of these folks are in their comfort zone as Witnesses. They grew up in the faith, all their friends are JWs, often the work for/with other JWs, etc. So there's a lot to lose and not a lot to gain by leaving the religion. For many, being a JW is truly the easy way out.
Olin Moyles Ghost
JoinedPosts by Olin Moyles Ghost
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Have your JW Relatives Explained about Generation/Overlap Change to You ?
by flipper inafter reading on the way out's thread about his mom explaining the generation overlap to him it kicked this idea into my head to make this thread .
i thought it would be helpful to see if anybody here has had jw relatives or friends try to explain this " generation overlap " theory to you as a faded or inactive witness and what happened in the conversations.
so please feel free to post your experiences.
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154
Last Night's Intervention
by brotherdan ini'm afraid of starting a new post because i've stepped on a few feet here with my last post... but i still love you guys.. last night i went home to find my wife and her friend on the couch with the bible, ready to show me how i'm wrong and exercising "apostate thinking".
my wife said, "i am unable to fight you with the bible because you know more than me about it.
but k** knows more and will be able to show you how you are wrong.. so my wife went into the other room so as not to be stumbled by my discussion.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Threads like this are fantastic because they show in stark relief the absurdity and tortured logic required to advocate for the WTS position. In Watchtower-land, prophets don't actually prophesy. Brilliant!
Facts don't matter, logic doesn't matter, even the plain meaning of words (such as "prophet" and "prophesy") don't matter. All that matters is to defend the Watchtower Corporation at any and all cost.
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According to the WTS, who are fulfilling Jesus' prediction that there will be many false prophets in the last days?
by Olin Moyles Ghost inthe bible predicts that there will be many false prophets in the last days.
here are some examples:.
matthew 24:11: "many false prophets will arise and will mislead many.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Yep, it all boils down to a desire to avoid accountability. But, as it often does, the WTS has weaved quite a "tangled web" with this one.
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154
Last Night's Intervention
by brotherdan ini'm afraid of starting a new post because i've stepped on a few feet here with my last post... but i still love you guys.. last night i went home to find my wife and her friend on the couch with the bible, ready to show me how i'm wrong and exercising "apostate thinking".
my wife said, "i am unable to fight you with the bible because you know more than me about it.
but k** knows more and will be able to show you how you are wrong.. so my wife went into the other room so as not to be stumbled by my discussion.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Reniaa: 24 For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible.
The false prophets in this time will claim to perform miracles and great signs. Witnesses do not do this and never have.
This is an interesting approach. Note that verse 24 doesn't simply say that the false prophets will claim to perform great signs and miracles; no, it says they will "perform great signs and miracles."
So, as I asked in my thread (http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/196460/1/According-to-the-WTS-who-are-fulfilling-Jesus-prediction-that-there-will-be-many-false-prophets-in-the-last-days)--who are the "many false prophets" that Jesus predicted would be running around in the Last Days?
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Last Night's Intervention
by brotherdan ini'm afraid of starting a new post because i've stepped on a few feet here with my last post... but i still love you guys.. last night i went home to find my wife and her friend on the couch with the bible, ready to show me how i'm wrong and exercising "apostate thinking".
my wife said, "i am unable to fight you with the bible because you know more than me about it.
but k** knows more and will be able to show you how you are wrong.. so my wife went into the other room so as not to be stumbled by my discussion.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Hello Reniaa,
Per your request, a scan of the article can be found here: http://www.myiphonestuff.info/qwotes/scans/1894_w_july_15_p1677.tif (under heading "Can It Be Delayed Until 1914?").
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According to the WTS, who are fulfilling Jesus' prediction that there will be many false prophets in the last days?
by Olin Moyles Ghost inthe bible predicts that there will be many false prophets in the last days.
here are some examples:.
matthew 24:11: "many false prophets will arise and will mislead many.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Thanks @brotherdan and @JWoods. Seems like it's nearly impossible to be a "false prophet" under the WTS definition. Makes me wonder where are the "many false prophets" that Jesus talked about...
In fact, even the 2012 doomsday crackpots can dodge the "false prophet" label under the Watchtower definition of the term. They're merely interpreting ancient Mayan calendars...they're not originating prophecy!
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Last Night's Intervention
by brotherdan ini'm afraid of starting a new post because i've stepped on a few feet here with my last post... but i still love you guys.. last night i went home to find my wife and her friend on the couch with the bible, ready to show me how i'm wrong and exercising "apostate thinking".
my wife said, "i am unable to fight you with the bible because you know more than me about it.
but k** knows more and will be able to show you how you are wrong.. so my wife went into the other room so as not to be stumbled by my discussion.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
WT - July 15th 1894 - "We see no reason for changing the futures- nor could we change them if we would. They are, we believe, God's dates, not ours."
Yes, the WTS is adept at "speaking out of both sides of its mouth."
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According to the WTS, who are fulfilling Jesus' prediction that there will be many false prophets in the last days?
by Olin Moyles Ghost inthe bible predicts that there will be many false prophets in the last days.
here are some examples:.
matthew 24:11: "many false prophets will arise and will mislead many.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Mythbuster: What publication is this in? I'd like to read it.
This type of reasoning is common in WTS publications and in arguments from WTS supporters. Poster "brotherdan" has a thread recounting a conversation with a JW who made similar arguments. One example is the 3/22/1993 Awake on page 3 under the heading "Why so many false alarms":
They are voicing expectations based on their own interpretation of some scripture text or physical event. They do not claim that their predictions are direct revelations from Jehovah and that in this sense they are prophesying in Jehovah's name. Hence, in such cases, when their words do not come true, they should not be viewed as false prophets such as those warned against at Deuteronomy 18:20-22. In their human fallibility, they misinterpreted matters.
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According to the WTS, who are fulfilling Jesus' prediction that there will be many false prophets in the last days?
by Olin Moyles Ghost inthe bible predicts that there will be many false prophets in the last days.
here are some examples:.
matthew 24:11: "many false prophets will arise and will mislead many.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
The Bible predicts that there will be many false prophets in the Last Days. Here are some examples:
- Matthew 24:11: "Many false prophets will arise and will mislead many."
- Mark 13:22: "for false Christs and false prophets will arise, and will show signs and wonders, in order to lead astray, if possible, the elect."
As we know, the WTS says that these are the Last Days. Thus, they should be able to point out "many" false prophets as Jesus predicted in Matthew 24:11.
But, in a transparent attempt to avoid accountability for myriad Watchtower failed predictions, the Society has redefined the word "prophet." The Watchtower and its followers contend that as long as you're interpreting something already written in the Bible, then you can't be a false prophet. Thus, the Watchtower definition of "prophet" is so narrow that it's basically impossible to be a false prophet.
In Watchtower-land, I could open the Bible to a random page--say, Haggai 2:21 "Speak to Zerubbabel governor of Judah, saying, 'I am going to shake the heavens and the earth," and assert that this verse means that there is going to be an earthquake in Alabama at 2:21 tomorrow morning--and I wouldn't be a false prophet because I'm just "interpreting Bible prophecy."
See how absurd this Watchtower logic becomes? As I mentioned in another thread, Watchtower logic excuses hucksters like Hal Lindsey (Late Great Planet Earth) and Ed Whisenant (88 Reasons Why the Rapture Will Be in 1988) from being false prophets because those guys tie their predictions to Daniel, Revelation, etc. Heck, even David Koresh based his predictions on the Bible. But none of these clowns are false prophets in Watchtower-land!
Since it's so difficult to meet the Watchtower test for a "prophet," then who in the world are these "many false prophets" that Jesus predicted would be roaming around in the Last Days? Any takers?
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The False Prophet Nathan?
by brotherdan inmy mom is addicted to the wts.
i've recently brought up the many false prophecies and she calls almost every week to show me new things that the society has said about false prophets and how they are not one.. the latest was the account where king david wanted to build god a temple.
he told nathan the prophet about his idea and nathan basically said, well god is with you, you should do it.
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Olin Moyles Ghost
Guys, remember that the WTS is free to redefine words as it sees fit. It did so with "generation" and appears to have done so with "prophecy." In Watchtower-land, it's perfectly acceptable to do all of the following, and you're still not a false prophet:
- Assert that a small group of clergy (the GB)-- to the exclusion of everybody else--has been appointed by Jesus to provide food and that this group of clergy is the only group of the world that is "spirit-directed."
- Assert that, being directed by God's spirit, the Bible tells us that God will kill every man, woman, and child who does not follow this small group of clergy within "one generation" of 1914.
- Then, when it becomes clear that the "1914 generation" is dying off, make up a completely new meaning for the term "generation" in order to string your followers along for a few more years.
So, it's perfectly ok to claim that God is using you--and only you--to get his message out (isn't that what prophets did back in the day?), and when you're wrong there's no accountability. Pretty good little gig if you ask me! All the benefits, and none of the accountability. Never underestimate the audacity of clergymen! (or the gullibility of their followers)